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Post by swamprat1 on Jan 5, 2013 16:47:44 GMT -7
CWI that's a great right up and I agree with many points, though I intend to read through it again when I get to the pc. However, as to what I was suggesting, it would not be so much a group as providing travel assistance.
For example, say Will had to get from Florida to Texas. If he needed a known safe place to stop overnight, he could stop at my place. There he would be able to rest with little worry and if he needed vehicle repairs I could help with that. Give him and his family a hot meal and a warm bed.
Several things you mentioned do apply here though. For instance, honesty and integrity. How do I know(and this is all hypothetical, not picking on you Will) that Will is not going to wait till I'm asleep to take me out and ransack my house. On the same token how does Will know that I would not run off with his rig.
Yes, it would be a lot to figure out. But would it be worth it.
And I do like your 5+2 criteria. Wish I could catch up with some like minded folk in my area. The small group I was part of has drifted apart due to the lack of some of those qualities.
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Post by mud on Jan 5, 2013 22:02:38 GMT -7
For the record mud, the idea of the logistics book was already thought of by the group. However, our security experts nixed that one. There are to many details that can be farmed out of that data for comfort. One thing I do not do is mention anything the group hasn't already agreed is open. For the most part we try to take an open book approach, but there are some things better left unsaid. understood. Like most of us, I feel confident in saying should you end up where we are, our resources are at your disposal....within opsec of course. Sounds like your group has covered as many bases as possible, even those crossed within. Oh what we flies on the wall could learn! I hope you understand I was not asking to join your group or pry for info. While we are fledgelings in ours I feel that through research and trial and error we will become solid. As before, and I hope in the future, I can still hold you as a friend and sometimes confidant while looking forward to that cup of joe! Kudos for another well thought out post!
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Post by ColcordMama on Jan 5, 2013 23:09:42 GMT -7
Wow. Fascinating. Wish I could be part of a group like that, but I'm afraid age is against me now. I for one am willing to be part of an underground railroad, giving shelter and a hot meal to Bunker buggers if necessary. Anyone in such a situation finding themselves in central Arizona should contact me here through a PM.
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Post by Ceorlmann on Jan 5, 2013 23:26:36 GMT -7
In addition to what angelhelp said:
While we don't have an official group outside of those living in our house there is a window for potential. Within less than a mile of our house reside a good number of veterans; two of whom I know either directly or through family members. Go out about a mile and there is someone I know who is very like-minded as well as a veteran. I've been looking for a good opportunity to get us together and possibly start something even if it's just basic knowledge of each other and a basic mutual trust. It's better than nothing.
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Post by mud on Jan 6, 2013 0:30:28 GMT -7
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Post by Cwi555 on Jan 6, 2013 3:12:17 GMT -7
understood. Like most of us, I feel confident in saying should you end up where we are, our resources are at your disposal....within opsec of course. Sounds like your group has covered as many bases as possible, even those crossed within. Oh what we flies on the wall could learn! I hope you understand I was not asking to join your group or pry for info. While we are fledgelings in ours I feel that through research and trial and error we will become solid. As before, and I hope in the future, I can still hold you as a friend and sometimes confidant while looking forward to that cup of joe! Kudos for another well thought out post! I didn't take it that way. It wouldn't have mattered if I did either as something like that would be out of my control anyway. I may have founded it, but I have to live by the agreements set forth with everyone within it, or it has no value to none of them or myself. I do hope no one thinks ill of me for that stance, it's just how it has to be. As for the cup of Joe, thats a given my friend.
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Post by WILL on Jan 6, 2013 4:40:19 GMT -7
CWI that's a great right up and I agree with many points, though I intend to read through it again when I get to the pc. However, as to what I was suggesting, it would not be so much a group as providing travel assistance. For example, say Will had to get from Florida to Texas. If he needed a known safe place to stop overnight, he could stop at my place. There he would be able to rest with little worry and if he needed vehicle repairs I could help with that. Give him and his family a hot meal and a warm bed. Several things you mentioned do apply here though. For instance, honesty and integrity. How do I know(and this is all hypothetical, not picking on you Will) that Will is not going to wait till I'm asleep to take me out and ransack my house. On the same token how does Will know that I would not run off with his rig. Yes, it would be a lot to figure out. But would it be worth it. And I do like your 5+2 criteria. Wish I could catch up with some like minded folk in my area. The small group I was part of has drifted apart due to the lack of some of those qualities. Get out of my head you mind reader . I'm paranoid too, but recognize the need for help and that none of us can do it all. I guess we all have to trust others to some extent in the end. I'm open to the idea of assisting others with a rest stop/temporary refuge. I fear I won't be much help for most since I basically live in the corner of the country on a giant peninsula. However, any travel from me in a SHTF almost guarantees a need for those services. So I kind of feel like a leech on this one. You guys are sweet for offering though. Let me ask you guys a question... I know we are all internet friends here. With the exception of those who already have real contact with each other…in the real world, how well do we really know each other? Seriously, it’s super easy to be an internet warrior or mask or otherwise omit serious personality issues, kind of like CWI’s alcoholic friend did. Am I the only one who is slightly reluctant to take the jump from internet buddy to life line in the worst kind of human tragedy? Especially since I’ve tipped my hand to those here about what I have, my weak points, etc. It makes me feel very vulnerable and unsure of what I’m getting my family into. I guess the reward would outweigh the risk, but jeez this kind of stuff eats at me.
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Post by Ceorlmann on Jan 6, 2013 5:08:52 GMT -7
Well Will I say it's ultimately a gamble we take if we choose to go through with it. I've only met one of our own in person thus far, and am in non-forum/internet contact with at least two others. I think one way to help build the trust and bonds between us to get such an UR going is do what has been going on already; whether it's (for example) buying oldcoothillbilly's zombie-killing-tactical-survival fire biscuits, or doing more of those Christmas gift exchanges; as both are things that you choose to do on your own initiative, and in a way getting to know the other person better (applies more to the gift exchange than anything else). Then of course there's also the classic "meet and greet."
I'd throw the UR invitation to those of us who we know in person or via good, solid correspondence, and go at it from there. Just my 2 cents for what it's worth.
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Post by xwing on Jan 6, 2013 6:28:34 GMT -7
this shows how the kids in my family think.... My nephew Sam came up and sat down next to while we were squirrel hunting a few weeks ago and said" Uncle Pookie, Why dont we just wait for the stuff to hit the fan and instead of going to Ro Ho's, we just take over Walmart or Academy's? They got all the stuff we need to stay alive a long time...We can block the front entrance and would be able to keep everyone out.".....Sam is 7 years old......and that was on his mind.....Jimmy, That is Dace's little brother....who was with us on our Black Creeek trip.
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Post by wtrfwlr on Jan 6, 2013 6:36:15 GMT -7
Sounds like Sam would get along with one of Swamprats young-uns who is around that age. He's already squirreling away snacks in his own little "hiding" places in his room (for later ya know!)
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Post by Cwi555 on Jan 6, 2013 8:22:09 GMT -7
Will,
There are several traditional levels of familiarity regarding people. There are co-workers, social acquaintances, correspondences, pen pals, childhood friends, friends, husbands, wives, etc. The internet has created a new one as will be judged by history.
Correspondences and pen pals would be the closest thing to it, but it doesn't really cover it. Here you see the mind behind the eyes without the interference of the eyes. That can be a good thing, or a bad one depending on your patience level and memory. What is missing are the personal inflections only a live meet can display. That to can be overcome with time.
Everyone has a pattern to their thoughts, it is inescapable. In the short term, you have no idea who your actually speaking with. Over a period of months and years, that persons individual thoughts and pattern of thoughts come out. The words used become less important, and secondary to the overall patterns. Very often the people that think most alike don't get along very well in the beginning, yet very well after a year or two, and people with thought patterns that are not agreeable generally show themselves in that same time frame. Then there are all points in-between.
Most of the people here have shown their hands long ago. You made note of that about yourself in this thread and others. For an underground railway as CCM put it, you know more about these people than the actual participants of such a railway from historical terms. Insurgence in WWII took in a lot of GI's without knowing them, people took in total strangers in Sarajevo simply based on gut feelings and the look in their eyes.
Here you've at least had the change to get to know something about the person in a way that can't be hidden over the proverbial card table. Something for you to consider.
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Post by missasip on Jan 6, 2013 8:27:45 GMT -7
this shows how the kids in my family think.... My nephew Sam came up and sat down next to while we were squirrel hunting a few weeks ago and said" Uncle Pookie, Why dont we just wait for the stuff to hit the fan and instead of going to Ro Ho's, we just take over Walmart or Academy's? They got all the stuff we need to stay alive a long time...We can block the front entrance and would be able to keep everyone out.".....Sam is 7 years old......and that was on his mind.....Jimmy, That is Dace's little brother....who was with us on our Black Creeek trip. Well he sounds like a pre-prepper...lol Ya got to love it... Jimmy
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Post by WILL on Jan 6, 2013 8:43:56 GMT -7
Will, There are several traditional levels of familiarity regarding people. There are co-workers, social acquaintances, correspondences, pen pals, childhood friends, friends, husbands, wives, etc. The internet has created a new one as will be judged by history. Correspondences and pen pals would be the closest thing to it, but it doesn't really cover it. Here you see the mind behind the eyes without the interference of the eyes. That can be a good thing, or a bad one depending on your patience level and memory. What is missing are the personal inflections only a live meet can display. That to can be overcome with time. Everyone has a pattern to their thoughts, it is inescapable. In the short term, you have no idea who your actually speaking with. Over a period of months and years, that persons individual thoughts and pattern of thoughts come out. The words used become less important, and secondary to the overall patterns. Very often the people that think most alike don't get along very well in the beginning, yet very well after a year or two, and people with thought patterns that are not agreeable generally show themselves in that same time frame. Then there are all points in-between. Most of the people here have shown their hands long ago. You made note of that about yourself in this thread and others. For an underground railway as CCM put it, you know more about these people than the actual participants of such a railway from historical terms. Insurgence in WWII took in a lot of GI's without knowing them, people took in total strangers in Sarajevo simply based on gut feelings and the look in their eyes. Here you've at least had the change to get to know something about the person in a way that can't be hidden over the proverbial card table. Something for you to consider. That's a great way of looking at it. You’re right on the money about it being uncharted waters for relationships. I’ll admit it, I'm still reluctant to jump in with both feet on an address exchange, and here’s why. The closest thing to what we’re proposing here would be developing a relationship over the internet and then meeting to get married. I’ve heard some horror stories about that kind of stuff. But our stuff is even more serious because it’s life or death when we meet. In a marriage you can get divorced and walk away. If a mistake is made here, somebody dies. You can get an idea of how a person’s brain works, but there can be a whole lot more to a person than their written word. That’s why I’m sticking with solely family at this point. I don’t even trust my friends with this kind of stuff. I don’t mean to insult anyone on the board because you all seem like very nice people. This is my issue with trust, not anything anyone else did. I probably need a shrink ;D
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Post by woodyz on Jan 6, 2013 8:59:23 GMT -7
Wow. Fascinating. Wish I could be part of a group like that, but I'm afraid age is against me now. I for one am willing to be part of an underground railroad, giving shelter and a hot meal to Bunker buggers if necessary. Anyone in such a situation finding themselves in central Arizona should contact me here through a PM. ColcordMama if you need a place to go in Arizona I can give you someone you can trust, he will have a group, I do not know the group but he will make sure you stay safe to the best of his ability.
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Post by ColcordMama on Jan 6, 2013 9:58:30 GMT -7
Wow. Fascinating. Wish I could be part of a group like that, but I'm afraid age is against me now. I for one am willing to be part of an underground railroad, giving shelter and a hot meal to Bunker buggers if necessary. Anyone in such a situation finding themselves in central Arizona should contact me here through a PM. ColcordMama if you need a place to go in Arizona I can give you someone you can trust, he will have a group, I do not know the group but he will make sure you stay safe to the best of his ability. I live in Arizona and have resources already established between my house and BOL, but thank you for the offer. But let's say a member was in LA and heading east, and just before getting to Phoenix needed a cot and a hot. That's where I come in.
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